Recently fought Kenshi's strongest enemy with 100s in basically every stat and opted to capture him instead of kill. I cannot understate how helpful of a decision this was if you wish to get your characters to 90+ in their combat stats. Do NOT kill this guy, capture him. Even if you find prisoner training tedious, so far this guy has gotten me to 91's in combat stats (weapon stat included) and you get a solid 1% per swing for quite a while, too. Dex also levels quickly this way if you pick a weapon that's based on cutting damage, though unfortunately training against him does NOT seem to be a good way to increase Strength. Strength training continues to be best when finding a huge group of foes and using a weapon that's too heavy for you.
Anyways, I've always been interested in what the "best" performance is for endgame Kenshi IF your focus is being the best 1v1er. Even though there's no PVP, I enjoy hypothetical questions of what the best setup would be if we did have it. I somehow doubt I'm alone here, so I thought I'd share some insights from the training I've watched:
Dex is NOT attack speed, strength is.
If you meet a weapon's strength requirements, then you can typically expect your attack speed to be at .90 or higher. Without stacking gear to increase speed, I've typically seen my character range from .96 to 1.09 based on variations in dex. Strength however? Having double your weapon's weight in strength score is the difference between .59 and that .96. Strength likewise doesn't really have much of a gradual increase, but feels much more sudden. With Strength, it feels like there's thresholds where your speed goes from .59 to .76 to .89 and above, all rather suddenly rather than gradual drops.
Dex comparatively, I've seen my character get a -40 due to injuries and all it's done is drop his attack speed from .99 to .92 or so. The difference is very negligible compared to strength and doesn't feel too noticeable.
Dex feels far more like the defense stat, as your block speed will simultaneously drop from something like 2.92 to 2.12 with that same 40 dex hit. Really, dex is more what you want if you want your character to be able to react and block hits, but if you're stacking dex to increase your attack speed...? I'd argue it's far more effective to simply stack strength to create a greater buffer that protects you from dropping below that critical strength threshold. If you're using something like a polearm, this isn't a concern whatsoever and ok you might as well grab dex, but for those using heavy weapons or hackers? Oh yeah, stack strength.
ALL weapons swing at the same speed once their strength requirement is met.
I equipped various different weapons to see if perhaps the ones with lower weights swung even faster thanks to my character being way above their requirements. NOPE. Every single weapon reported the same attack speed and all were noticeably fast. The moment you have 100 strength, you're swinging that Plank as fast as your swing the Iron Club, even if it doesn't seem like this should be the case. Only meaningful difference beyond that is their animation set, more on that below when discussing Hackers and Polearms.
Melee Attack/Defense bonuses on gear matter a great deal for end-game and potentially more than we thought otherwise
This surprised me given that these bonuses become trivial for much of the game, but it sort of makes sense. Hell, perhaps they were never trivial, we just have difficulty tracking their effectiveness since we fight all kinds of enemies that are significantly stronger and weaker throughout the game. I made another post today talking about how Beep was easily the best fighter for damaging Cat-lon when I went to fight him, and I now suspect this is because Beep had the most gear upping his melee attack.
For late game, the thing to realize is that by the time you and your opponent have 90+ in melee defense, this is hitting a point where you're expected to block 95% of the time. I can honestly set my game to speed x3 and watch neither side take damage for a good 20 seconds.
Because of this, melee attack and defense buffs matter. They seem to change how aggressive your character acts (more melee attack = they swing more) and I also notice a significant difference in how many hits land when using full samurai armor (-12 melee attack) vs. using Assassin's Rags. (+8 melee attack) The exact same can be said for Guardless Katanas vs. Holed Sabres, so for those thinking the Combat speed and dex of assassin's rags were to thank, the Guardless Katana vs. Holed Sabre setup is exactly why I suspect it's melee attack and defense that matter more.
Because of this, you can basically "choose" if you want an offense or defense-orientated character at the end. You will feel debuffs to your attack and you will feel debuffs to your defense too. I'd say anything above 5 is noticeable, and it's only the minor +/-2 ones that I'd scoff at as negligible.
Yes, Samurai armor is pretty much the best
There's some competition for it like White Plate Jacket, but Samurai Armor seems pretty much designed to be the best for late-game. The protections it provides are significant because these protect your stats from injury debuffs. The minor combat speed debuffs are honestly negligible. I compared my character with Samurai Armor and Leggings vs without and he dropped from 1.04 attack speed to .99. It also lacks a dexterity debuff, so your block speed isn't hindered whatsoever.
However, I personally don't see any purpose in anything other than Wooden Sandals. These give a minor attack speed and athletics bonus in exchange for no defense, but most legwear only has a 40% chance of working anyways, legwear often already provides good coverage and the legs aren't exactly the most vulnerable or frequently attacked bodypart.
One reason alternatives such as White Plate Jacket could be seen as viable is outlined above: it has no debuff to melee attack whereas Samurai Armor does. (and it's stomach protection is 100%) If you want a more offensive character, then Samurai Armor kinda works against this by nuking his melee attack by -8 for the chest and -4 for the helmet. Helmet alternatives like the Armoured Plate or Masked Helmet could likewise be chosen for this purpose to avoid stat debuffs.
As an aside, because of the above point on dex, chainmail feels like a trade: you're starting the fight with lower initial dex and block rate in the hopes that even though you start lower, you'll maintain that block rate better thanks to better protection. Difficult to say if chainmail is a good idea or not.
Heavy Weapons are NOT the best weapon class, Hackers and Polearms are
Keep in mind I'm talking about a scenario where it's yourself with endgame stats using the best gear vs. an opponent doing the same. The battles where this matters within Kenshi are very limited and as such Heavy Weapons are often just as/more practical for gameplay. If you're interested in hypotheticals about if PVP were implemented and we started fighting each other OR you want to be able to 1v1 Kenshi's strongest enemies, then this applies.
The issue with Heavy weapons is that their strength requirement is really pushing the limit and making you vulnerable to injury debuffs. If you're using the Exile Plank with 100 strength for example, then it won't be long before you're injured enough that you fall below that required 96 strength threshold for fast swings. Late game, character defense gets so good that slow swing speed is basically a death sentence; you will not hit SHIT because that expert blocker has loads of time to react. By using Heavy Weapons, you're just making yourself vulnerable to this.
Likewise, the tradeoff isn't worth it. If you're facing someone in Samurai Armor, you're not even doing more damage than someone with a Hacker, so you're making yourself vulnerable to strength debuffs with absolutely no benefit. I had Hackers doing 40+ damage while the Plank did 33 and the Falling Sun did 22. (vs. Samurai Armor and 100 toughness) The only benefit is range, but you have to question if this is worth it when the Polearm is a much safer alternative with just 2 less range than the Plank.
The Fragmented Axe is basically 100% nonviable. It is impossible to wield this thing without being vulnerable to a strength debuff. Great for cutting down scrubs, terrible for fighting someone on your level. The only way is to willingly use a lower damage Fragment Axe, but even in this case, the Plank offers a more efficient damage-to-weight ratio. The Plank and Falling Sun are both weapons you'll definitely want strength prosthetics for to give yourself a bit of a buffer, but depending on how strength score is calculated, this may not help much. (depends on the order that buffs/debuffs are factored in)
So why Hackers and Polearms?
Simple. Armor penetration. Hackers will provide consistently high damage regardless of what enemy you face, Polearms do the same, but faster. A Hacker is capable of hitting the damage of a Heavy Weapon while being far more lenient on strength requirements; someone knocking you below the strength threshold is unlikely for these, or if it happened, it would likely be the final nail in the coffin for an already losing battle. Heavy Weapons comparatively, strength can screw you just as the fight is getting started.
Why Polearms though if they have lower damage?
You can't really pick one as being the best because it becomes a matter of preference. The main thing setting these two apart is attack animation. Anyone that's dabbled in martial arts know the character animations matter; these aren't just cinematics to convey what the numbers are doing behind the scenes, these actually matter. Sometimes your dodge animation gets hit because...well, it got hit! They hit you during the dodge animation itself and that counts.
The thing about Hackers is they have a different animation set than Polearms. Hackers have an overhead swing and a sort of baseball bat horizontal swing. That baseball bat swing has a notably slow recovery time, even when you're swinging it at optimal speed. That recovery seems to remain even if you max out attack speed. This is the difference that makes Polearms viable, because their horizontal swing is identical to Katanas. It's executed much quicker and recovers much quicker. I have staggerlocked my training opponent with a Polearm, but I've yet to do the same with a Hacker. With these, you trade in damage for more speed. Personally, I'd dare say the Polearms are better, simply because you can get better range for groups and better speed for 1v1s; again, a Polearm at peak performance can attack just as fast as a katana. Being the first to strike means your opponent is also suffering injury debuffs before you are, so that can matter. Should also mention that yes, the Short Cleaver suffers from the slower baseball animation too, despite being one-handed. Can still be viable as a sidearm if you dislike indoor debuffs though.
Regardless, it's preference: do you want immediate, meaningful hits or do you want more opportunities for damage? Between the individual Hackers and Polearms, it becomes stat preference too. The difference in damage between Hackers is negligible, so it becomes a matter of their bonuses. Paladin's Cross offers better range and a very significant robot damage boost, Combat Cleaver has no penalty indoors. The Polearm offers better range and attack bonus, the Heavy Polearm offers less but in exchange for a smaller indoor bonus. Your choice really. (cept Naginatas, lol fuck those guys)
And just to reiterate, again, this is specifically in regards to 1v1s vs. opponents that are as high in stats and well-geared as you are. In terms of practical Kenshi gameplay, Heavy Weapons are still very much capable of competing with these two, as are Sabres and blunt weapons. Katanas and Martial Arts are the only weapon classes where you can encounter serious hurdles based on your opponent.
Sidearms MAY provide buffs/debuffs regardless of if they're being used or not. (keyword "may," difficult to confirm)
Ironically, katanas may shine most not as viable endgame weapon options, but as sidearms that modify your stats. The system does not showcase changed stats based on weapon wielded in any way, but rather the melee stats are shown regardless of weapon equipped. Fight someone with a Katana as backup, your melee attack is higher. Remove it while your character is still using their Plank or whatever, and you still see their melee attack drop. I'd like to test this more, but it's difficult to do. Most I can do is see if Paladin's Cross robot bonus applies to a katana sidearm, but even if it doesn't, that doesn't neccesarily mean the melee attack/defense aren't factored in differently. I can only say that thusfar, it feels like their buffs matter.
The Guardless katana for example will give you a nice boost to your attack, the Katana will provide a more modest one with less defense loss, the Wakizashi provides a bonus to both indoors.
Bare in mind though characters tend to go for their sidearm indoors if their main weapon has a debuff for it. They treat the weapons as though the buffs are exclusive to the weapon used, so using a polearm indoors means they'll likely try to use the sidearm, forcing you to unequip it to stop using it, and thereby removing it's buffs. It would only be a boost for outdoors, but universal for a weapon like the Combat cleaver.
If anyone has any additional input on this or if someone can dispute a claim I've made, feel free to do so. As I said, I'm curious about if sidearm buffs apply in particular, but it's difficult to test since it's still chance-based.
Submitted February 22, 2019 at 02:50AM by AFlyingNun https://ift.tt/2EpLZaj
No comments:
Post a Comment